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Redefining Our Womanhood
Posted: Jun 26, 2007 4:43 AM   in response to: MaisMuslimahin response to: MaisMuslimah


You have probably read just one opinion and based it on that. The problem with this logic you have described is that unless someone has an "Islamic Degree" anyone else's opinion is not credible. There weren't Islamic degrees during the time after the sahibas and hadiths were written about nearly 65 years after the prophet pbuh passed away. I do not discount the hadiths you quoted, as they are the same hadiths that are quoted and discussed in the links I also have provided, however the Prophet (pbuh) never commanded women to cover the hair, nor is it mentioned in the hadiths that you've quoted, plus, one hadith you mentioned is weak and has a missing chain and is still silent about covering the hair. I have read your article on Sheikh Nuh's response, another "internet blog" as you described my links, months prior to my response here yesterday and I totally disagree with this opinion as there is NO EVIDENCE either from the Quran or Sunnah that the khimar must cover all the hair. The Prophet never ordered it and neither has Allah (swt) ordered us to wear a khimar (covering) on our heads. Some Arabic women were not even wearing the khimar at all, if they did it was ornamentally hung around their heads or necks & main use was for desert purposes such as the heat of the sun and sand storms. It would be interesting if you studied where the history of veiling faces and heads actually originated from. However you are free to follow your opinion as I am free to follow mine but I disagree strongly with you if you are saying all women must cover their hair, as only the bosoms (jayb) is mentioned in the verse in the Quran about the khimar, the "shar" and "ras" or the head is not even mentioned and my point above is very clear.

I have given you numerous links from various scholars, but if you want to disregard and discredit them as only internet blogs that is up to you. Sheikh Nuh that you quoted and Yusuf Qaradawi are only two Islamic Scholars there are many, many more diverse scholars. Amjad Moiz from Understanding is not just a lay person or an internet blog, he is an Islamic Scholar from the Al Mawrid Institute in Pakistan  and Shehzad Saleem from the same Institute is another Islamic Scholar. Dr Zaki Badawi, also another Islamic Scholar has the same opinion about the headscarf not being obligatory is yet another. Tariq Ramadan with the same opinions that the headscarf is not fard, is another and I have given you a link from Ruqayyah Maqsud who also says a women covering her chest with the khimar has fulfilled her Islamic duty according to the Quran and no where in Islam can women be reprimanded for not covering her hair or how they choose to dress.

No one is forcing you to take your headscarf or veil off so in the same courtesy no one should be forced or compelled to wear one or be called a "hypocrite" if they don't, as some women deride others. Women have the right to choose which Islamic opinion they wish to follow. I suggest you read all the opinions of various scholars below before making assumptions about me or my intelligence or before you start a lengthy debate and attack me with fabricated or weak hadiths and mistranslations of hadiths. I can also copy and paste large passages form scholars but I do not like to intimidate people as that is something I beleive my faith does not teach me. That is why I have provided you with the links but you have obviously not taken effort to read or research any of them.

If you want other hard evidence from scholars, I suggest you first start reading and studying all the links I given before debating with me and then research this further through these two books, one is from a female scholar who has studied in Al Ahzar University (it also makes me wonder why there are such few female scholars):

Qur'an and Woman: Rereading the Sacred Text from a Woman's Perspective by Amina Wadud (Islamic Scholar)

Believing Women" in Islam: Unreading Patriarchal Interpretations of the Qur'an  by Asma Barlas

Origins of Hijab

Context of Hijab

Headscarf & Veiling

A Critic upon Jilbab

Splitting Hair to Cover Hair

Must a Woman Wear a Jilbab?

Hijab Has Nothing to do With Morality

The Qur'an Does Not Mandate Hijab

Misinterpretation of Quranic Verses on Hijab

Thoughts on Hijab By Sr. Ruqaiyyah Waris Maqsood

So it is not right to make women who are not wearing a headscarf feel they are unchaste by making yourself appear more holier than them. Read the Quran verse very carefully and think about what type of people Allah swt considers pious. No one has the right to force women how to dress or dictate to others how to follow the path of Islam or how women should dress.

You have no right to tell me which scholar I should follow. I do not follow any scholar but the Quran and the Messenger. I use my Fitra and my conscious and see which is the most Islamic opinion and follow that.

Most importantly Scholars are not infallible, they are not those we worship. And Allah swt has told us to use our intelligence and to refer to the Prophet or the Quran if we disagree. Also not all people who have not got a degree in Islamic studies from Qatar or Saudi are lacking in sense or intelligence. 

In the end our duty is to obey Allah and the Messenger. As long as feel we are doing our duty and we are dressed decently and not hurting others, that is what matters. There is no compulsion in religion. This is clear from the Quran passages and from the Prophet's life.

O you Children of Adam! We have bestowed on you raiment to cover your shame as well as to be an adornment to you. But the raiment of righteousness, that is the best. Such are among the Signs of Allah, that they may receive admonition.” (Quran 7:26)

Laa ikraaha fi-d-deen. Qad tabayyana ar-rushdu min al-ghayy

There is no compulsion in religion. Wisdom has been made distinct from the untruth.  (2;256)

The Holy Prophet (peace be upon him) has said that Islam is a religion of the middle path (Wast). The Qur'an has called the Muslim nation 'Ummat al-Wusta'.

وَكَذَلِكَ جَعَلْنَاكُمْ أُمَّةً وَسَطًا لِتَكُونُوا شُهَدَاءَ عَلَى النَّاسِ وَيَكُونَ الرَّسُولُ عَلَيْكُمْ شَهِيدًا … (البقرة 143)

Thus have We made of you a middle Ummah, that you might be witnesses over the people, and the Messenger a witness over yourselves… ( al-Baqarah 2:143)

Wasalam,                                                                                                                                            Fitra


Re: Redefining Our Womanhood
Posted: Jun 26, 2007 4:47 PM   in response to: Fitrain response to: Fitra

All of the 4 major schools of thought have agreed that it is mandatory. How can you disagree with all of them when they learned from the Prophet (SAW) and his companions (may Allah be pleased with them) and instead, take the opinions of the modern "scholars" with the typical fast-food-fatwas many of them give?

You're right, the women of the time used to wear scarfs on their head and just leave it trailing down their backs. That's why the verse tells them to drape it over their chests. If you have a scarf on your head already and you take part of it to drape it over your chest, what would you get? A hijab! Why would Allah tell the women to cover their heads if they already were covering? He simply told them to go further and wrap the cloth that was already there back to cover their chests which would then cover their ears and neck in the process.

Arabic is a rich language with many meaning for words. The meaning of Khymar means "top cover." That's a covering for the head.

You said yourself that scholars are not infallible yet you have quoted scholars and are relying on their opinions against the OVERWHELMING amounts of opposing opinions by not only more reputable scholars but the 4 major schools of thought. And more than a couple of the scholars aren't even native Arabic speaker yet you use their translation of Arabic over native speakers' translations.

You have quoted many scholars, yes. But the ones that oppose this view FAR outnumber them to be incomparable. You have chosen to go with the minority view instead of the majority which is what we have been told NOT to do by the Prophet (SAW) and what's worse is that you are spreading your opinion to Muslims that might not know any better. Either way, I've spoken out about what is wrong. The Prophet (SAW) warned women that if they are dressed but naked (not attired properly) that they will not even SMELL Paradise. I've fulfilled what I'm required to as a Muslim. You are entitled to keep your opinion but I am required as a Muslim to speak out when a Muslim is doing something against the Sunnah and Quran.

I am not trying to force you to wear hijab. There is no compulsion in religion, that's right but there are commands from Allah that we have to follow. It is up to you if you want to use your conscience to tell you what is required however, that is not reliable since we can't tell what is speaking to us, our conscience, our nafs or Shaytan. That is why we were given explicit orders by Allah and one of those is Khimar (top cover) and hijab (screen). It's up to you if you follow it or not. Insha'Allah I have done my part to encourage good and forbid evil. I'm done with the discussion.

Asalaamu alaikum                                                                                                                        Nichole

Re: Redefining Our Womanhood
Posted: Jun 26, 2007 7:23 PM   in response to: MaisMuslimahin response to: MaisMuslimah

To Mais Muslimah or Nichole,

You are obviously a convert, right?

Do you know me? Have you met me? Have you seen me? The answer is obviously no.

I follow Allah, His book the Quran, His Prophet and I am a Muslim.

It is therefore totally unIslamic for you to say to me or to any other sister that I am leading myself and others to Hell, just because I have an alternative opinion on the headscarf to you or because I do not follow your choice of scholars. I have been a Muslim all my life and none of my Muslim sisters have ever insulted or degraded, or condemned me to Hell. You are not in the position to pass personal judgements about my Faith as only Allah (swt) has that exclusive right & He is the final Judge whether or not my religion is as you say "watered down." 

1. First of all, as a Muslim you should know that we are entitled to have different views and as long as we are obeying our Creator and not going against the Quran or Sunnah then it is no one's right to intimidate, abuse, condemn or hold in contempt or curse another believer to Hell.

2. As Muslims, we have rights and duties in how interact and treat one another. You should know that in Islam, Muslims should love one another for the sake of Allah and that the Prophet pbuh warned Muslims of having contempt for one another. Also in the Quran Allah swt told us to be united and not to quarrel (8:46).

3. Just because a Muslimah may not wear a headscarf does not mean she is not pious or that she is naked or will go to Hell. Your claim is unfounded. No where in the Quran or any hadith did Allah swt or the Prophet condemned any woman who did not cover her hair by saying that she is naked or will go to hell.

4. You base nakedness on uncovering the head, when neither the Prophet said this, nor in the Quran did Allah swt reveal any verse which says that women must cover the head or the hair, so your argument is baseless. Allah told women to cover their chests, He did not mention the hair.

5. Men uncover their hair but they are not naked, yet the Prophet also wore a khimar (a covering) on his head, ever thought why men don't cover and follow his Sunnah? Yet, when women uncover their hair according you, they are naked? There is no logic in that. A woman wearing a black headscarf is no different than one one who isn't covering her head or hair. That hadith you quoted, is about thickness of clothes, it's about not wearing shear, see-through clothes, and not looking indecent on the streets so that every man will turn his face- do you understand?

6. Islamic thought comes from two bases the Quran and the Sunnah and if anyone follows those then they are safe. Allah swt has always addressed modesty, chastity and piety. Do you know what these terms mean or not? The only body parts mentioned specifically is the covering of the women's chest. Covering the chest with the khimar, which means use a covering to cover the chest. The articles I posted above explain the definition in great detail. All of the hadiths you have quoted have nothing about covering the hair. One hadith is weak and has a missing chain as I said before, for which I have given you links to check up earlier but you still have not done so. If the scholars are reading this then they know which hadith I am referring to.

7. You say, how can I disagree with the four schools of thought? Because I worship Allah and follow Prophet Muhammad pbuh, not scholars or other men. Your claim that all four schools of thought enforce women to cover their heads and say it is mandatory is wrong and incorrect. For a start the four schools of thought are not in the position of the Prophet or Allah or the Quran and they have not made the headscarf into such an issue as you have. Secondly the scholars of the four schools of thought were clearly humble.

We should learn from their humility as they never forced any woman to cover her head, in fact these scholars would wake up in their grave if they saw two Muslims fighting over an issue that is not obligatory yet treated like the central pillar of Islam - understood?

8. As explained before, you have quoted incorrect hadiths that have nothing to do with covering the hair or head and neither have you read or researched any of the links from other scholars or other Islamic sites that I have posted above. Why don't you write to each one of the scholars that I had mentioned and ask them why they have different opinions?  I am sure they will enlighten you, though I must add that Dr Zaki Badawi has passed away may Allah forgive him and have mercy on him, so you may not be able to contact him for references, but you should be able to find his and other sources easily from the internet. 

9. Remember everyone in this forum are reading our comments and Non-Muslims have made it clear the type of arrogance that they dislike in Muslims, your anger and hostility and lack of understanding towards me about this sensitive subject is a catalyst, so we should use our self control and use our wisdom and sense as well as Islamic adab and sources to solve issues and not make matters worse for each other or other Muslims suffering from the wars because of our behaviors. This, in it self is huge lesson that we should not take for granted.

10. Finally, I did not come here for a heated debate or to quarrel with you, as that is also prohibited in the Quran (see 8:46), but since you have made these false allegations and have condemned me to Hell before you have even met me or others, then I felt I had to make it clear so that the same mistake does not happen in this thread to others. I hope from Allah it will be an atonement for me for the hereafter.

Finally, let us learn from this experience and practice the essentials of Islam first the Islamic adab from the Prophet's Character, before we make covering of the hair on the head into the central pillar of Islam even when our Lord and Creator of the Worlds has not done so.

O you Children of Adam! We have bestowed on you raiment to cover your shame as well as to be an adornment to you. But the raiment of righteousness, that is the best. Such are among the Signs of Allah, that they may receive admonition.” (Quran 7:26)

He alone knows that I have spoken the truth.                                                                                Wasalam                                                                                                                                                      Fitra


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